DogAsTherapy

It's been three years since I left active duty, and almost four years since my last deployment. It seems the further I get though, the worse it gets. It is not as much the flashbacks and intrusive thoughts, as just the general anger and rage that overcomes me. I feel like this is a permanent shift in my personality and I can't necessarily say one for the better. I used to be so fearless and eager for new experiences and to go to new places--granted without a lot of cautious planning. Now the spontaneity is replaced with a fearful reluctance. I lived in NYC for several years before I joined the Marines, and the thought of going back for a week, having to be surrounded by so many people and the crowds was more terrifying than my desire to leave my small Midwestern town to get some culture. I can't bring my knife on the plane, so what would I do? I felt so enormously vulnerable.

THe thing is I prefer to be isolated now. I feel like a huge pink elephant in the room--I can't talk to the women who are mostly housewives around me, nor can I speak to the men in depth because a) the wives get jealous, or b) some guys take it the absolute wrong way. I haven't had a good female friend (non-military) since I left the service. Because what do I have in common with you? Do you want to talk about pointing weapons at Iraqi civilians and having to pull the trigger when you really weren't sure what you were firing at? Or should we talk about bloodied bodies and grown men screaming in pain? But let's talk about make-up and clothes and hair. I can do it superficially at dinner parties now, but I can't bear it. I feel like a freak of nature. At least when I was in, I had my guys around me, I had my rank to protect my gender from overt harrasment (at least most of the time). Now? I am just like any other woman and it freakin sucks. And all I want to do is just lash out and either chew someone's ass or let them know they don't want to piss me off. But that takes too much effort, and I am too tired. I just want to keep getting up in the morning and try to find one beautiful thing each day. I don't know what I need or when it gets better. I just know this has been going on for a while and not getting better. I think it would be more damaging to speak to someone who doesn't have a flippin clue what Im talking about or can hardly relate. THAT angers me, for some stupid irrational reason. SOmeone please tell me that I need to go pop some pills or take up something constructive. For a few years anyways, I was able to physically release my aggression through PT or running or boxing. But an old injury has now limited my activity to dog walking and the occaisional elliptical machine--not much of a war dog now, HA!

I have moments that almost feel normal. But then I get in a car, or get around people, or deal with a stupid comment that sets me off. I just defend and delay, defend and delay. Part of me says that I need to stop feeling sorry for myself--there are so many who have gone through so much worse and the last thing I want to be is some self-pitying person who doesn't realize just how good and lucky i actually am.

Corky

I can't tell you how long...but please don't think you are feeling sorry for yourself or self pity. This is why this website has been founded. I was in 10 years. Broke back and was put out 8 months into Desert Storm. I didn't experience any combat. There are many women on this site that have similar experiences. I hope you continue to visit this website and get to communicate with others who have felt the way you have and are. I'll keep you in my prayers.

wrench wench

I was dx'ld with PTSD 20 years ago...due mainly to MST and 6 years as one of the first/only women on the flightline. Different kind of combat...friendly fire. I read your post and right there with you. I had a lot of therapy and some meds back then...and was pretty good until this year. I am crawling back up from the relapse I had... thanks to the local VA (honest!) ...Lindy...some other vets...and meds.

Here is what I can tell you...it doesn't help to talk to people who have no idea what you are talking about. It's not their fault that what is mundane to us is a big deal to them. That used to piss me off too. Slowly I realized a lot of my rage was legit and a lot of it was because I felt abandioned and an outsider when I was really hurting. I felt like I was in an alternative universe...looked like the one everyone else was in...but not. And why torture yourself with the glazed uncomprehending look in the eyes of those who don't get it? Is there a vet center near you or a group at the VA (if your local is any good)? Use us here...or join an on-line group.

What about therapy? Saved my life on several occasions and has made a huge difference. It's not easy...but it really helps. Having said that...get the right person. Some knucklehead who is clueless, dismissive, patronizing or more freaked out by your stuff than you are totally sucks. I would look for a PTSD or trauma specialist with a proven track record. Don't discount meds. I wish I had done them sooner once I was convinced to take them. I don't feel stoned or anything...just normal. And it really helped with the sleep and nightmare stuff. Getting consistent good quality sleep is half the battle.

There is all kinds of physical activity...I like Tai Chi. I did a lot of kempo back in the day and like the agressive release. How about wing chun or some of the soft chinese martial arts...have used a speed bag too. Walking my dogs is a biggy too. There is a major physical component to PTSD and your body's response to what you have been through. I find I have to be mindful and aware...not my usual hypervigilance/arousal thing...of where I am each moment when I start to get wrapped around the axle. Feel my feet, feel the wind, feel my breathing, notice the little snippets of beauty that are everywhere...stay present...you are safe and ok this nano second...then the next...then the next. You aren't crazy....you are responding to crazy shit and your brain/body is doing it's best to protect you in advance.

Hope this helps...feel free to contact me.
wrench wench

GIJane

On Christmas Eve I joined Grace After Fire after stumbling across it through a search engine. My boyfriend and I were sitting around the house discussing the depression I get over the holidays and the madness that ensues during this time of year. Before I got deployed in Dec 2004 to Iraq, I still found this time of year to be irritating, but not like now, and now it extends beyond the holidays into my everyday life. Bare with me, this is going to be long winded, but hopefully you'll find it helpful, or at least entertaining.

When I read your post, my jaw dropped, I asked my boyfriend to listen while I read it to him, and he just looked at me and said, "Did you write that?" The night before I read your post I was in a real funk, and even though he is in the military as well, he had never been deployed, but he listened, again, as I talked about my unexplained and unprovoked rage as I drove the 30 mile trip home from work. It started when I was at a red light and was talking on my hands free when I looked over at a group of 4, 12-13 year old kids staring at me and laughing at me for no reason. Maybe they thought I was talking to myself, I don't know, but in a split second I yelled with rage at the top of lungs, "What the fuck are you looking at", which entertained them even more. I was so pissed off, that when the light turned green, instead of continuing to drive home, I made a turn on a side street to head back to those sullen little bastards and do I don't know what, but damnit they were going to be sorry they messed with me. And then a voice of reason came over me, and I just sat there in this alley thinking to myself, what normal 37 year old adult would do this? Why is this bothering me so much? How is this rational or accpetable behavior, etc., etc. Well I put myself in check, got on the highway, and started to calm down.

This was the day before the massive blizzard we got here in Maryland, so of course everybody and their mom was out in droves congesting the already crazy roads here in the DC area. I knew I had to get a snow shovel and get some supplies, so I begrudgingly made the trip to Home Depot. Out of snow snovels. Walmart, out of snow snovels, Target, negative. Meanwhile, there are crowds of people battling for parking spaces, people honking horns, people just being rude and selfish, an everyone for themselves kind of mentality.

By the time I got to Target, my anxiety was pegged, I found the first Target employee and said, "Let me guess, you're out of snow shovels", and she said yes. Well I stormed off saying god I hate this F**CKING state, and proceeded to go home defeated without a snow shovel. After 5 minutes of calming down yet again, I realized I needed to go to the grocery store, so I regained my composure, walked in, and wouldn't you know it, right there in my line of sight were snow shovels! I was feeling better, I was laughing at myself for getting so pissed off. I grabbed a shovel, put it in a nearby empty cart, and then this older lady appears out of nowhere and says very curtly, "Excuse me that's my cart." I just looked at her, I'm sure not very friendly like and said something like, well there was no one around, I had no idea. Anyway, I left my stuff in the cart, went out and got a new one, and rolled it to her and said, there you go, when I really just wanted to shout expletives at her for getting so upset about a damn grocery cart.

I'm telling you this story of that day because that day is not the exception, it is the rule. Not only do I get pissed off very easily, but I avoid large public places, I'll avoid social situations. I too feel like it is a permanent shift in my personality, because I was nothing like that before. I had a million friends, went out all the time, and now, I'm practically a hermit, I'm overly cautious of people and places and it sucks because I feel like I'm no good in those situations anymore.

I would love to talk to you more, and anyone else out there that feels like this, that knows these behaviors and feelings are crippling and wants to continue to be the strong women we are, and fight this battle as well. Hopefully you feel like you can relate and take care, it will get better. I realize now that we, all of us, have to open the lines of communication and get this crap off of our chest.

DogAsTherapy

Thank you everyone...

your posts were amazing and I am truly humbled--to think that I thought I was the only person.

GiJane--I very much can relate, thank you. The Rage is something pretty interesting and I am curious where it really comes from. My own theory is based on the fact that the majority of the females served in CSS (Combat service support roles)--I did convoys myself--and having to abide by some of the absolutely asinine ROEs in the early part of OIF/OEF (don't shoot civilians period; don't shoot civilians until you can make a positive ID they have a weapon; don't shoot civilians unless they are driving over 40mph at your convoy with their lights off) I think make thigns worse for PTSD. My husband has killed a lot of people and struggles with his own demons and a ton of guilt. But I also believe it to be freeing. Would I have endangered my guys as I did because I felt I had to abide by the ROE? For those of us who are surivors of sexual assault (I am external from the military): the replaying theme of would you have fought back??? I can't even begin to imagine what some of the 'Lionness' Squads went through (women in the US Army mostly who were embedded with the Grunts who went door to door, cleared houses, searched female Iraqis-GET SOOOOOME!!!!)

Maybe this all compounds over years and years--the feelings of vulnerability and helplessness, and we're all trying to get one step ahead of that horrible gut-wrenching feeling that everything is about to go to sh*t and there ain't a damn thing we can do about it.

Personally, I am afraid of my anger. I fought for years in competitive/amateur martial arts and can relate to WrenchWench's testimonial to the calming effect that it has, as well as the calming motion of forward movement. But I can't sit long enough to calm that side. I know that you can't fight effectively when you're seeing red--you make stupid mistakes. I spent both deployments staying so freakin calm because of that knowledge. And now all I want to do is let go of all of it. THe thing is, I know how badly I can hurt someone, I've done it before. I am afriad that if I truly blow up in public, if I got a concealed weapons permit, and I was having a particularly bad day, I'd wind up in jail or worse. Please don't take that I am this unstable--about-to-go-postal-gal....That much I do have control over. I recognize how dangerous that is, and for that reason I remove myself from lots of public places where I know I'll get pissed off; I don't allow myself to get drunk anymore. I just spend so much energy and time keeping this beast chained up so it can't harm anyone. I feel like The Hulk, "You won't like me when Im angry".

Jane--I completely relate to your story about the kids in the car next to you...I feel like 9/10s of the time, the majority of these 'incidents' happens on the road (mainly because I isolate msyelf otherwise--ha!) and I feel like my license plate should be enough of a warning (I have a Vet Plate) "Seriously, back the $*#$ off..."

So my question is this: do men go through the same range of emotions as us? Or are we feeling this more because we're female? I know there have been a few studies on females and PTSD and I am curious to know how combat related PTSD differs from sexual assault related PTSD vs males' dealing with PTSD?

wrench wench

In my experience...yes...men go through similar rage, acting out, guilt, insomnia, etc. We are different, chemically, hormonally, culturally...so there are some differences in response. My PTSD informal reading says more women get PTSD and it is usually more intense/ longer lasting if the trauma involves personal assault. My guess is that this has to do with feeling helpless and unable to defend yourself so all the adrenaline and boiling emotional chaos gets frozen. But this is not unlike having to drive a truck through a hostile situation with ROE's preventing you from protecting yourself from someone you know damn well is going to try and kill you. It puts the hairs up on my neck thinking about it.

So what happens when you live in a perpetual state of fear and are helpless to defend yourself (not unlike a battered kid)...body has only three basic responses: Fight, flight, freeze. Being pissed off is better than being pissed on, right?And the longer you have to quash that normal reaction...the bigger the rebound when your lizard brain thinks it is safe to vent. I can tell you that I was the same way when I got out. I trusted no one when I got out. I was fearful because the environment was so different and on hypervigilance big time and just waiting for someone to start something. Being angry felt way better than being afraid...afraid of others and my own explosive internal feelings. I carried a knife...I sometimes packed...I was ready...bring it on a*****les!

I tried therapy a few times...but we didn't know much about PTSD back then...except women didn't get it (!!). I had many enlisted and medical women friends who served in Vietnam (and WWII and Korea) that could put paid to that theory. Anyway, I knew it wasn't normal to track every human's position around me for a hundred yards, know the make and model of every vehicle I passed and how long they were behind me, taking evasive action, etc. Unable to be in a crowd...even a classroom...take public transportation, etc.
The overwhelming depression that rolled in when I exhausted myself. The constant urge to bitchslap the kids I was in college with because their reality was lightyears younger in maturity than mine now was. I felt like an alien space creature.You get the drift. I drank, I did drugs...nothing helped. Except talking to people who understood. For me, that was the Vietnam Veterans OutReach Project...now the Vet Centers. I began to seek out and find other sister vets and unload... and listen.

You can't fix me and I can't fix you. But just knowing your not alone and that someone isn't going to judge you or freak out by what you tell them...and understands at a gut level is huge. And the sooner the better. The longer your brain repeats these response patterns (hypervigilance, hyperarousal, rage, insomnia, etc) the deeper they get entrenched and the easier to revert to that way when you get triggered by something. That is why meds are good for some of us...stress management classes...therapy...etc. YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO THRU THIS ALONE! And you are NORMAL!!! It's all about survival...and your brain doesn't know you are out of danger yet. IT TAKES TIME. Be patient with yourself...it's called recovery. You went thru a kind of marathon. But it does ease up and you can have the life you want to have. Will you be like you were before you deployed? No. But a divorce, a health issue, kids, travel, crime, job loss....all those things will also change you forever. Those who go thru this kind of stuff have a greater appreciation of all sides of life unlike any other. It sucks now but you are a richer human being.

Sorry if I have come off like a fingerwagging granny ...my heart is touched by your stories and I want to help.
Wrench wench

shayden

ladies - your stories are amazing and you sure as hell are not the only ones!

id have to say that having been back from deployment for two years, i wonder if this crap will ever subside...ever get better?!?

the anger scares me most. never before would i randomly get angry. now, i feel sorry for the people that happen to cross my path and do the wrong thing at the wrong time. ive yelled at passers by, cashiers, etc. afterwards, i look at myself and wonder who in the hell i have become. hell - i used to talk to anyone and everyone....now, good luck getting me in a group i dont know!

it is a comfort knowing im not the only one struggling from anger. yet i have no clue how to get beyond it. i try breathing...counting to ten...but my anxiety and anger then begin to join one another to ultimately kick my ass.

guilt is probably the next demon - questioning why i lived and they didnt. haunts me often...especially around "family occasions" such as the holidays and anniversaries of friends' deaths. unfortunately, this is one of those mysteries i am not quite sure i will ever figure out...

needless to say, there are multiple other affects from OIF. i have accepted i will never again be the same person i was before the war, but i am hoping "better" exists....

wrench wench

yeah...that anger beast is intense. For what it's worth...here's what I work on. I know my anger is because I feel threatened in some fashion. Sometimes I don't know what is triggering me. Sometimes it is internal...sometimes it is external. Example: bad case of road rage could be part the knucklehead tailgating and part my fear of an unknown attacker and part not eating all day so my body is freaking. I work on trying to realize I am often in a state of arousal from not eating right, sleeping, exercising, meditating, etc or cranked about running late, something the boss said, etc. By the time someone does something relatively minor...I am ballistic. Trying to count to ten or think happy thoughts at that point is like pissing on a forest fire. All I can do is get away.
I have to stay in my body, listening to my body every moment to get better.
We have been subjected to phenomenal stressors that put our bodies in that fight or flight mode over and over and over. It's like we have a super highway to that reaction level. I am trying to build some turn outs and trunk roads so I am not that wound up before something flips me out. It seems to be working but I have to spend more time than the average person being mindful every moment. I think it is working, too. I have had years of being pretty symptom free.

DogAsTherapy

It is nice to not feel like I'm going through my own silent rage. It's funny because I totally agree, Wrench Wench, how men and women process their anger differently. My husband has been through quite a bit more than I, but he is perfectly happy watching all the military channels, war movies (played at ear blasting surround sound, so you can 'really' feel the flashback) and all before going to bed! I don't want to be reminded--at all! I don't want to watch a soldier screaming on the side of the road covered in his own blood from an IED.

The funny thing is that about 80% of the time, I am so much more calm than I was before teh deployments. I don't stress about things as much as I did; I think our bodies know that we are healing, and that if we are going to get worked up, it is going to take a lot out of us.

To Shayden's comment earlier, there is no doubt that any of us will ever be the same. I guess part of me is in mourning for the 'old' me: loved 4th of July, going to music festivals with lots of crowds, going to new places and exploring unknown lands. But there is no doubt that I would ever want to go back to the old me. This is now a part of who I am, and at the end of the day (or long restless night), I wouldn't change an ounce of me.

eagleheart

[


I dont think we over go alll the way back to the old me. I think it gets better though. I feel more at ease at times or that part of me is healing. The therapist I see is helping me to get out of the victim mind set which is knew information for me. It feels like if I do that I will feel freedom.




]It is nice to not feel like I'm going through my own silent rage. It's funny because I totally agree, Wrench Wench, how men and women process their anger differently. My husband has been through quite a bit more than I, but he is perfectly happy watching all the military channels, war movies (played at ear blasting surround sound, so you can 'really' feel the flashback) and all before going to bed! I don't want to be reminded--at all! I don't want to watch a soldier screaming on the side of the road covered in his own blood from an IED.

The funny thing is that about 80% of the time, I am so much more calm than I was before teh deployments. I don't stress about things as much as I did; I think our bodies know that we are healing, and that if we are going to get worked up, it is going to take a lot out of us.

To Shayden's comment earlier, there is no doubt that any of us will ever be the same. I guess part of me is in mourning for the 'old' me: loved 4th of July, going to music festivals with lots of crowds, going to new places and exploring unknown lands. But there is no doubt that I would ever want to go back to the old me. This is now a part of who I am, and at the end of the day (or long restless night), I wouldn't change an ounce of me.[/quote]